Comments on: More foreigners to Finnish workforce - it’s up to you http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/ Thu, 20 Nov 2008 14:20:38 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: Sami http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/#comment-139 Sami Tue, 29 Apr 2008 05:15:31 +0000 http://www.arcticstartup.com/?p=247#comment-139 Indeed, it's true that even if we got 100,000 immigrants, they're of no use if they're all on our unemployment benefits ;) I agree the ICT sector is more "enlightened" in this respect - already 10 years ago I worked for a company in Helsinki that had over 10 nationalities in a group of less than 50 people. The root cause for not hiring enough foreigners is probably, unfortunately, xenophobia at some conscious or unconscious level. Indeed, it’s true that even if we got 100,000 immigrants, they’re of no use if they’re all on our unemployment benefits ;)

I agree the ICT sector is more “enlightened” in this respect - already 10 years ago I worked for a company in Helsinki that had over 10 nationalities in a group of less than 50 people.

The root cause for not hiring enough foreigners is probably, unfortunately, xenophobia at some conscious or unconscious level.

]]> By: Miikka Kukkosuo http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/#comment-140 Miikka Kukkosuo Mon, 28 Apr 2008 20:31:10 +0000 http://www.arcticstartup.com/?p=247#comment-140 Sami, you're totally right the marketing of Finland should be improved a lot. And getting 100k+ immigrants would certainly require some branding silver bullet... My point was mainly that even if you had a great brand and "good" climate (whatever that is), it's little use getting the foreigners here if no one hires them (this would be the grassroots approach I guess). There are a bit too many stories of well-educated foreigners not landing even interviews - even if they spoke excellent Finnish. In the ICT sector and among the younger generation I hope things are looked at differently in general, but in the economy/society as a whole a lot needs to change to really support that amount of new immigrants (maybe it's forced by the circumstances soon). Otherwise the spouses of the main hires will not find (get) a job, and it doesn't take too long for your new hire to relocate with his/her family once again. Sami, you’re totally right the marketing of Finland should be improved a lot. And getting 100k+ immigrants would certainly require some branding silver bullet…
My point was mainly that even if you had a great brand and “good” climate (whatever that is), it’s little use getting the foreigners here if no one hires them (this would be the grassroots approach I guess). There are a bit too many stories of well-educated foreigners not landing even interviews - even if they spoke excellent Finnish.

In the ICT sector and among the younger generation I hope things are looked at differently in general, but in the economy/society as a whole a lot needs to change to really support that amount of new immigrants (maybe it’s forced by the circumstances soon). Otherwise the spouses of the main hires will not find (get) a job, and it doesn’t take too long for your new hire to relocate with his/her family once again.

]]> By: Sami http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/#comment-141 Sami Mon, 28 Apr 2008 15:24:28 +0000 http://www.arcticstartup.com/?p=247#comment-141 .. and in case someone is delusional and thinks that Finland IS actually being marketed in a good way, check out this video via my whine about it and think again: http://www.groundswell.fi/sim/2008/04/28/this-is-how-we-get-100000-immigrant-workers/ .. and in case someone is delusional and thinks that Finland IS actually being marketed in a good way, check out this video via my whine about it and think again:

http://www.groundswell.fi/sim/2008/04/28/this-is-how-we-get-100000-immigrant-workers/

]]> By: Amit Kucheria http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/#comment-142 Amit Kucheria Mon, 28 Apr 2008 14:58:33 +0000 http://www.arcticstartup.com/?p=247#comment-142 Miikka, you have hit the nail on the head when urging SMEs to hire foreigners. Of course there are lots of advantages to hiring a fellow Finn in the short run: - No need to compare level of education with foreign degrees - No need to change to English (Finns hesitate to use English citing lack of fluency when in my experience they are quite good at it, perhaps just a lack of practice) - Supporting the local labour market (a good reason) But here are a few things that adding a few foreigners to your company might bring about: - Unless your business is targeted strictly to the local market, working with people from various cultures gives a better insight into those communities. - Look upon foreigners as a conduit to expand your business beyond your boundaries; when they decide to leave Finland you now have a trusted contact in another country. Miikka, you have hit the nail on the head when urging SMEs to hire foreigners.

Of course there are lots of advantages to hiring a fellow Finn in the short run:
- No need to compare level of education with foreign degrees
- No need to change to English (Finns hesitate to use English citing lack of fluency when in my experience they are quite good at it, perhaps just a lack of practice)
- Supporting the local labour market (a good reason)

But here are a few things that adding a few foreigners to your company might bring about:
- Unless your business is targeted strictly to the local market, working with people from various cultures gives a better insight into those communities.
- Look upon foreigners as a conduit to expand your business beyond your boundaries; when they decide to leave Finland you now have a trusted contact in another country.

]]> By: Sami http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/#comment-146 Sami Mon, 28 Apr 2008 14:23:02 +0000 http://www.arcticstartup.com/?p=247#comment-146 Individual anecdotes don't help. I also know foreigners who've moved here for e.g. the nature, not bothered by the climate - not enough to stay away anyway. Unfortunately, no matter how great we may think Finland is, the fact is that Finland does not enjoy a great reputation among the potential immigration candidates. I mean here there are talks of getting 100,000 foreign workers here in a relatively short time period. It's the "how" part that's missing - with what marketing? With what reputation? It's no coincidence that in the expat-community in Finland, the question as to why someone is here is formulated as "Love or Nokia?". Frankly, I doubt we we enough hot single women to rely on them as the primary source of immigrants ;P Individual anecdotes don’t help. I also know foreigners who’ve moved here for e.g. the nature, not bothered by the climate - not enough to stay away anyway.

Unfortunately, no matter how great we may think Finland is, the fact is that Finland does not enjoy a great reputation among the potential immigration candidates. I mean here there are talks of getting 100,000 foreign workers here in a relatively short time period. It’s the “how” part that’s missing - with what marketing? With what reputation?

It’s no coincidence that in the expat-community in Finland, the question as to why someone is here is formulated as “Love or Nokia?”.

Frankly, I doubt we we enough hot single women to rely on them as the primary source of immigrants ;P

]]> By: Miikka Kukkosuo http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/#comment-145 Miikka Kukkosuo Mon, 28 Apr 2008 13:11:04 +0000 http://www.arcticstartup.com/?p=247#comment-145 Well I don't think the climate is a determining factor in immigration. Sure, for some it might be a huge issue, but for example at Digital Chocolate we have people from Brazil, Chile, Spain, Australia...heck, there's even one girl from Florida who said she prefers the climate here to the one over there. :) And then again, it's not that everybody working in Finland would need to stay here for good either. Well I don’t think the climate is a determining factor in immigration. Sure, for some it might be a huge issue, but for example at Digital Chocolate we have people from Brazil, Chile, Spain, Australia…heck, there’s even one girl from Florida who said she prefers the climate here to the one over there. :)
And then again, it’s not that everybody working in Finland would need to stay here for good either.

]]> By: Sami http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/#comment-144 Sami Mon, 28 Apr 2008 12:41:13 +0000 http://www.arcticstartup.com/?p=247#comment-144 I've got one word for you that will end a lot of the long-term immigration dreams to Finland: climate. I’ve got one word for you that will end a lot of the long-term immigration dreams to Finland: climate.

]]> By: Odin Chen http://www.arcticstartup.com/more-foreigners-to-finnish-workforce-its-up-to-you/#comment-143 Odin Chen Mon, 28 Apr 2008 12:08:11 +0000 http://www.arcticstartup.com/?p=247#comment-143 *Thumbs up* Nice said Miikka. If only English is used in all paperwork in Finland, that would make a much better international business environment. *Thumbs up* Nice said Miikka. If only English is used in all paperwork in Finland, that would make a much better international business environment.

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